Baseball Toaster was unplugged on February 4, 2009.
Email me at btimmermann@gmail.com
Select a date:
Is the enemy of my enemy my friend?
That is the question I will ponder on this penultimate weekend of the college football regular season. The highlight of this weekend will be the 78th renewal of the USC-Notre Dame rivalry. The two schools have played what is college football's best rivalry. It is one that has been played since 1926, with the schools missing each other only for three years during World War II (1943-45). Notre Dame leads the series 42-30-5.
As most of you well know, I'm a UCLA alum. And to most of my friends who are UCLA fans, the choice of whom to root for in this game is clear. Most UCLA fans root for Notre Dame because they want to see USC lose. After all, USC is the archenemy of UCLA. But for me, this is one week where I bleed cardinal and gold, instead of blue and gold.
But why is this so? Have I lost my UCLA fandom bona fides? I don't think so and my reasons for rooting for USC this Saturday are a combination of factors.
1. Unlike many UCLA fans, I wasn't born a UCLA fan. My parents moved to California with no allegiance to any college. My mother went to a small women's Catholic college in Belleville, Illinois, that folded up shop right as she graduated. My father didn't graduate from college, but attended one year at Saint Louis University. (Interestingly, my mother lived in St. Louis, while my father lived in Illinois. They didn't meet until after they were out of college.) My mother dictated most of her children's sporting allegiances when her sons were young. And in the early 1970s, my mom's favorite football coach was John McKay. She loved his sense of humor. She liked how his USC teams would go and whip up on the Ohio State teams of the distinctly unhumorous Woody Hayes in Rose Bowls. Mom had no patience for short-tempered martinets like Woody Hayes. She probably didn't use the phrase "short-tempered martinet" however.
When our family would watch McKay's weekly highlight show on Channel 4, McKay would joke about his days in Catholic school. This religious affiliation though was only brought up when USC was facing Notre Dame, coached at the time by Ara Parseghian. Mom loved to point out that USC had the Catholic coach, while Notre Dame had a Protestant coach. But what Mom was really getting at was that the religious affiliations of people in sports didn't matter. She told us we didn't have to root for Notre Dame because we were Catholic. She told us to root for the team we liked. God didn't choose sides in sports. As it turned out we liked the team that was the home team rather than the team from Indiana. We liked the team that came back from being down 24-6 at the half to win 55-24 in 1974.
I realize that all of this happened around the time I was about six years old until I was about twelve. People like to say that children are very impressionable then. I guess those people have a point.
2. Sticking with the religion theme, Notre Dame does like to hit you over the head with its Catholicism. And this is understandable as it is the most widely known Catholic university in the country, although I'd argue that Georgetown is probably a better school academically. Notre Dame has had "Touchdown Jesus". The PA announcer at the stadium tells you when Mass is after the football game. Some of the players come out and pray on the field before the game. Notre Dame is supposed to be God's Team in the view of some of its fans.
I've always found this distasteful. It's hard to explain this, but I always think that Catholics should be above thinking that they are holier than anyone. You're taught in Catholic school about all the things you've done wrong or could do wrong or might have done wrong. You tend to start with an image that you've already screwed up and you need to ask for forgiveness for something. Although this doesn't seem to apply to Notre Dame. They like to appear beyond reproach. Well, they're not. Go to Confession, Notre Dame fans. It's good for the soul.
3. There is a spillover from basketball. If I could go back in time to January 19, 1974, I would alter time to make sure that either Dwight Clay or, even better, Digger Phelps didn't exist. Digger Phelps is one of history's greatest monsters. It pretty much goes: Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Digger, Pol Pot, and then Slobodan Milosevic. Sorry, this part is personal. Very personal. If God exists, why did He let such a miserable human being like Phelps to break John Wooden's streak. Why couldn't it have been Ralph Miller or Dick Harter or Bob Boyd or Marv Harshman? I could live with that.
4. I almost always root for any team from the West Coast when it plays against a team from another part of the country. I certainly don't want Notre Dame recruiting players from the West Coast. If any West Coast high schoolers go to Notre Dame, I can only hope that they are cursed with Ron Powlus Syndrome.
5. The Leprechaun. College football's most annoying mascot. Now if Traveler were to say, have an unfortunate accident that involved hitting the Leprechaun, would I be sad? Umm... Let me get back to you on that.
6. Just why did Paul Hornung get the Heisman Trophy in 1956?
7. Notre Dame won't join a conference in football and won't admit that they don't because they can make more money as an independent. A lot more money. Money you can take away in a convoy of armored trucks stretching from South Bend to Gary. Just be up front and say it's all about the money. It's not about the tradition. Penn State's tradition has survived a move to the Big 10.
That's enough of an unfocused, rambling tirade from me for the time being. I will keep this thread open for people who want to discuss this weekend's action on the gridiron. And if you find a football game played on a gridiron field, please tape it for me because such a field would be really funny looking.
For your listening pleasure or displeasure. Or if you prefer you can listen to this one.
Although if I had to choose, the best college fight song, I would choose this one. It's so collegiate!
Have a nice Thanksgiving everyone. Even the Notre Dame fans, who are not bad people for the most part. But sometimes you just have to take a stand.
You can also feel free to discuss NFL games. And if you actually get the NFL Network where you live, I hope you enjoy life in the Northwest Territories of Canada.
Links changed to YouTube clips for the fight songs. My usual site of Fightmusic.com didn't seem to work right.
Saturday's games. Which you probably know about (Notre Dame vs USC is at 5 pm PT)
Florida at Florida State, 9 am PT. The Gators hope to win this one, then beat Arkansas, and try to get into the BCS Championship through the sheer power of Urban Meyer's whining.
South Florida at West Virginia, 9 am PT. Bring a compass! The Mountaineers still aiming for the Big East title.
Syracuse at Rutgers, 9 am PT. The Scarlet Knights will either go to the BCS or something in Texas.
Kentucky at Tennessee, 9:30 am PT. Tennessee has won this rivalry game every year since 1984.
Oklahoma at Oklahoma State, 11:30 am PT. The Bedlam game will decide if Oklahoma or Texas plays Nebraska in the Big 12 Championship.
Louisville at Pittsburgh, 12:30 pm PT. The Cardinals can win the Big East too.
BYU at Utah, 12:30 pm PT. The Beehive Boot! A little known rule of the LDS Church requires Mormons to use profanity on this day.
Georgia Tech at Georgia, 12:30 pm PT. I predict that a team from Georgia will win.
Boise State at Nevada, 1 pm PT. If the Broncos win, one of the BCS bowl cities will have to roll out the blue carpet for the visitors from the Gem State.
Arizona State at Arizona, 3 pm PT. The Territorial Cup! The winner goes to a place like El Paso or Las Vegas. The loser goes to a place like Las Vegas or San Francisco or San Diego.
Wake Forest at Maryland, 4:45 pm PT. The winner moves on to face Georgia Tech in the ACC championship game.
Purdue at Hawai'i, 8:05 pm PT. The 'Bows are double digit favorites against an 8-4 Big 10 team. What a country!
I might quibble and say Army-Navy's a better rivalry, but that's my and my father's ex-Navy background speaking.
Happy Turkey Day, Griddlers.
Happy Thanksgiving everybody!
Have you ever asked yourself why other teams have joined conferences? I going to assume it wasn't for reasons of brotherhood exclusively. other teams joined for money and prestige that they might not get on their own. In what scenario does it help ND to join a conference other than how it is perceived by fans who dislike the athletic teams? I also would debate how Penn State has fared since joining the Big 10
["supposed to be God's Team in the view of some of its fans." ] I agree that these minority group of ND fans are misguided but "touchdown Jesus"(a mural of Jesus that is painted on the side of the campus library) and the PA announcer letting people know when Mass will be held seem to be superficial and off target in trying to make your point. many fans are attending ND games for the first time and one can't assume they would know when and where the Mass will be held. Like you said it is a Catholic University
Points 1, 3 and especially # 4 are ones I can support.
I will end with that your Mom sounded like a heck of a woman. I really enjoyed the entry you did about your Mom buying you a WS ticket. Happy Thanksgiving Bob and thank you for all the enjoyment you bring to others with the Griddle and your "work" at DT. Ditto for you Jon
I forgot to add that you are absolutely correct about St Louis cardinal fans and Frank Robinson though
The best reason to join a conference is that it makes scheduling a lot easier.
I know you have limited space as well, Bob.
I think teams join conferences to share the risks and the reward. If ND doesn't make the BCS or a bowl they don't have their share from other teams in the conference that are going to bowls. ND has big risk and big reward. I am also not an ND fan that absolutely abhors the idea of joining a conference either. As long as it is not the Big 10. ND will be playing 3 Big east teams a year strengthening their ties to that conference. Add that to their annual games like SC and Navy you get much closer to a conference like schedule.
ALthough I don't think ND minds the extra work it takes to schedule.
I'll be at the game on saturday night but I can't wait to read the thread when I get home(or sunday)
We're more of a Jesuit-oriented family.
perfect response as always
oh yeah, and the USC fight song (both themes, actually) is also the best one in college sports. it intimates a note of impending doom for the opposing team SO well, and it gets under your skin too if you're an opposing fan.
Ah, who am I kidding? Happy Holiday Di--.
Hey Greg? I can't say that, either. :)
Digger Phelps...Grrrr....
Happy Thanksgiving to one and all, and especially to our esteemed host!
Bombings, expulsion from Latin Amercia...They're like the James Bonds of Catholicism!
Normally, Notre Dame High of Sherman Oaks plays for Notre Dame University at the Coliseum for the USC game, but this year the university band is making the trip.
Interestingly, the Notre Dame High band is going to play with the UCLA band at the Rose Bowl on December 2.
That was Southern Cal's welcome back party on the national stage.
I was most displeased.
That's just because the band's so bad. It does make my skin crawl, but I don't give the song credit for it.
I believe the term is "systematic desensitization."
My seats at the Rose Bowl put me close to the USC band and far away from the UCLA band, so I work on discerning patterns to keep me amused.
The Notre Dame usher told me that he used to hate USC's fight song the most. Until Tennessee came to town. Then they heard "Rocky Top."
A lot.
You run a great site, Bob. Thanks for all the hard work.
Go Irish!
I guess they didn't count on that game being bad. I'll be watching the Civil War on FSN then instead.
I believe the NCAA ruled that ND could no longer have the high school band represent them for the SC game.
25
You are no slouch in the fall down funniest category either Mr Brock.
That statement about the high school band and the NCAA seems so absured that I know it has to be true because the NCAA has such bizarre rules.
The best players from Notre Dame High of Sherman Oaks almost always end up at USC or UCLA. Well, USC gets the running backs. But UCLA gets the placekickers!
(Except for the guy at Arizona.)
Ahh, the pride of Serra High. Altenberg passed away a couple years ago.
I covered a Serra High game a few years back where Altenberg's son was the head coach (Kurt was the Asst. Principal) and two of the assistants were Jerry Robinson and Marlin Briscoe.
However, it wasn't a very good team that year, although Serra is usually a pretty good team.
Then Paul McGuire called it a reverse.
On a reverse, the ball is handed to a back who runs one way and then a player coming the other direction is handed the ball and he runs the other way, i.e., the reverse direction. The plan on this is to get the defense to overpursue one way. The drawback with it is that it can take a while for the play to develop and the more times you hand off the ball, the more times you can drop it.
Also the flow of the play does not switch on an end around.
Flanker/Receiver around would help clarify.
And the triple reverse wide receiver pass backwards to the kicker, who then pitches it to Brad Melsby, who then throws it to Toledo, who passes it to the tight end.
The halcyon days of Bob Toledo. Did not think I would ever be saying that.
However, there was the small matter that no one on the UCLA defense ever laid a hand on Ron Dayne.
Ron Dayne is on a list of mine.
USC's offense hasn't been that efficient in its other eight games. Even Stanford just gave up 42 to USC.
And USC managed to rush for 193 yards.
USC just plain out-viscera'd the Hogs. Just like A&M is doing to Texas right now. Or, I suppose you have some wonky statistical explanation for that, too?
Right now, A&M has outgained UT by about 70 yards. 10 of 15 on 3rd down conversions.
From Colin in Morgan Hill, Calif.: I don't know of any USC fans that would say they hate UCLA more than Notre Dame. Maybe in the past, but not now. Especially with Charlie Wies being so easy to despise.
Feldman: Knowing a lot of USC fans, I think you might be right about that.
Trust me Bruce. USC fans still hate UCLA a lot. A whole lot.
Oklahoma can win its division of the Big 12 with a win over Oklahoma State.
We'd finally get an important Oklahoma-Nebraska game again.
These days are slightly different.
I know Andrew was loving that.
10 REM Shakespeare is better than Twain
20 GOTO 10
It just wouldn't stop proving it. It's mission in life was to prove it. And it did. Now, writing a program to pick the dumbest football announcer, that'd take skill.
All trickeration, all the time!
In other news, I hear Karl Dorrell is breaking out the screen pass against Southern Cal.
Don't go for 2 in the second quarter at home.
Thank you,
Me
I'll pass.
OSU's uniforms
Petros Papadakis
Really, if you don't want me to watch the game, just tell me up front. No need for the drastic measures.
For a guy, who actually has a job with USC (PA announcer for basketball games), he does a good job of being impartial.
He's just nuts.
It was really cold that night. Canyon High brought a heater. I stood by the heater much of the game.
I wasn't asked to try to tackle him. I likely would have failed at that.
His brother Tasso was very large, if I recall.
Even if those schools are Miraleste, RHS, and PV High.
Nice to see the Sea Kings back.
The only USC quarterback I would have a poster of would be Rob Johnson.
I miss Rob Johnson.
I loved Rob Johnson. The only other USC quarterbacks I liked as much were Matt Koffler and Scott Tinsley.
Oh the humanity!
One other player had white letters.
So yeah, there are probably some yellow ones in there as well.
They won't do that, but that was so cool before.
Would you?
WOULD YOU?
Thought you should know.
I don't see him doing a Brady Quinn here.
It was terrible.
Jesus.
The one in Corvallis.
Oh yeah, football talk...The only reason I want USC to win is so that it'll be that much sweeter when UCLA knocks them out of the BCS championship picture next week. Hey, it could happen!
Besides the chance that you are likely to fumble the ball away.
Must have hit it off the hozzle.
Nothing like a little radiation poisoning.
If you can't trust the former head of the KGB, who can you trust?
I'll contact my people around the local haberdasheries and see what I can come up with.
I think a few thousand have shown up for the game.
But at least Trevor Matich and Rod Gilmore are having nice arguments.
Except for the married priest thing. And the allowing gays thing. And the female priests thing.
Okay, maybe we're not Catholics, but we're rooting for the Irish!
It's easier to be a lapsed Catholic than to be a practicing one.
http://tinyurl.com/ylhdd7
My, mistake. Football open thread.
In that case, Fight on. Beat the domers.
This post looks like one of Plaschke's
Pete Bethard > Gary Beban
Break out your wishbones.
Cutler's gonna be a good 'un. Just not sure it will be this year.
Wait'll you see the new OJ®
The New OJ, with 75% less stabbing!
I would love it if USC and UCLA were on more or less equal footing in the Pac-10 in basketball. But with the exception of the Paul Westphal Era, the two schools always seem to be on opposite ends of the curve when it comes to quality.
Boise State 38
Nevada 7
Broncos go 12-0 and are probably headed to Glendale, AZ, for the Fiesta Bowl against either Oklahoma or Nebraska.
Maybe the Rose Bowl, which will get first dibs on at large teams, will pick Boise State!
OK, maybe not.
I believe that Boise State's spot, which was pretty sure, was made definite when Georgia Tech lost. The ACC champ is going to be ranked very low.
Time to move to the big(ger) screen. Need to open up a giant can of good old LA whuppin' retribution for poor, beleaguered fallguy Karl Dorrell. (Can you mix that many metaphors?) Reference Bob's reason #4. (#2 not all that weak either) Plus I remember when they wouldn't redshirt or play in a bowl game. Reasons of principle indeed.
Carry on here. Roundball another day.
If USC loses today or next week, then we are likely headed to a USC vs. Big East champ Rose Bowl. I don't think Notre Dame or Florida can jump over Michigan in the BCS.
Michigan vs. the Big East champ? Or LSU? Or Notre Dame?
I recently watched the end of last year's game. Which I had never seen before.
I should be in charge of stuff.
Cal= cow
Lee Corso lied to me.
I have no faith left in humanity.
The three runners on base ahead of Juan Pierre would have to be Jason Repko, Toby Hall, and Oscar Robles.
http://tinyurl.com/ymmpp9
http://tinyurl.com/tvlf8
I never needed nine professors for any class.
Talking to myself in a monologue.
I think what I need might be a full length leather coat.
Somebody just asked me if I registered to vote. . .
It's not business. It's personal.
That would just mean that Steve Smith would catch all the passes.
UCLA will likely lose because of an inability to score against USC.
Booooooo!!!!!!!!!!
Why do I doubt Bob Davie's accuracy in reporting that fact?
What criteria are we using to rate public schools?
Michigan
Notre Dame (if they don't drop below 12)
Arkansas/Florida loser or LSU (you can't have three teams from one conference)
Boise State (likely going to the Fiesta Bowl)
Rutgers/Louisville
Ugh. Michigan v. Rutgers, Louisville, and Boise State all at once. Can't send a loser to Pasadena--and that criterion now officially eliminates the Irish.
Fantastic win for BYU today. Absolutely great game, ought to go on ESPN classic immediately. The final play of the game came with 3.2 seconds left, BYU on Utah's 11 yard line. Utah rushed only 2 and dropped 8 into the endzone, since they were up by 4. Beck moved right, left, then scrambled hard right, stopped, and threw back to his left as he got hit. He found a receiver wide open in the end zone, and he caught it on his knees as the ball barely floated over the goal line. The offensive coordinator admitted after the game that the play he called was "everybody just run around and try to get open".
Why are these teams playing in Las Vegas?
http://tinyurl.com/yh5umt
One point, four seconds.
230 common ground
No, that would be taking it to extremes! :-)
Get your tickets now!
Again I ask: Why does USC schedule a basketball game at home the same day as the UCLA football game?
That means that the Rose Bowl is likely going to be Michigan vs. Louisville/Rutgers/LSU.
[235] the football game should be over by the time the basketball game starts.. and uh, more alumni are likely to be in town? i'm grasping at straws, admittedly.
LMU strengthening their claim for Florida's spot at #1 by leading Cal in Alaska.
Update: Cal now up by 2 in transitive land
USC vs. LMU at the Galen Center, tipoff 6 pm
Be sure to park in a place that gives you easy egress from the Arroyo Seco and then drive fast.
I think USC and UCLA should go back to playing their basketball games on back-to-back nights. I think it would be fun for the city.
Instead, the one at the Galen Center will be on a Saturday in January while the one at Pauley will be on a Wednesday in February.
Or install the triple option.
Hawai'i finished third in the Great Alaska Shootout. I wonder if you can fly nonstop from Honolulu to Anchorage.
I hope the USC band contracts the Ebola virus. And I hope that Pete dies.
Yeah, I'm a bit angry, and I'm not at my best right now. Good lord, I hate Southern Cal.
Would this playoff require us to be nice to Auburn? Tommy Tuberville always feels left out.
Well, at least you're not bitter.
The Great Alaska Shootout had Alaska-Anchorage, Loyola Marymount, Missouri-Kansas City, Pacific, Hawai'i, Hofstra, Marshall, and Cal.
I think the tournament has suffered from the addition of more tournaments in Hawai'i and Puerto Rico, which are also exempt events.
It wasn't too long ago when there was a Duke-Cincinnati final.
Remember that these things are cyclical. USC won't always be this good. Just be patient. USC will only keep up this level of play for another 3-5 years.
Although I understand, I really have nothing to say to you.
You're the UCLA grad that defies description. I'll just accept it and move on.
I suppose you don't want to know that USC sent flowers to my mother's funeral either.
Hating USC is the Sonny play. It's emotional.
But if you go off half-cocked trying to beat USC, you'll end up getting riddled with bullets at the toll booth.
And James Caan was on the sidelines! Bob Davie was star-struck!
Southern Cal is a football factory. Chauncey Washington was a marijuana smoking failure who got into USC. That's what USC is. I can handle losing to USC, as long as we never sell our soul.
In the movie Michael said it wasn't personal; it was just business.
In the book Michael said of course it was personal; all business and everything else is personal.
We report. You decide.
Forget it Greg, it's Trojantown.
USC players can't read. Wow.
Um...Not really the same thing.
I'll leave it at that.
Sure, were gonna lose, but it won't change the hate that burns inside.
Spoiled Children, I hope you all die.
The hate I have for Southern Cal knows no bounds.
Try not to kill any more women before the game, SC...
UCLA hopefully new #1 team in the country.
Nobody will every be able to take that away from us.
{Total loser UCLA mentality}
I hate this week.
sorry
This is a night of spit takes for me.
I just become another person. A bad person. A person with horrible thoughts.
It just needs to be over.
Both UCLA and USC have taken to giving the "road" team worse and worse seats each year.
Except at the Rose Bowl, there the UCLA fans just sell the good ones to USC fans.
Greg Brock::USC
Marty::AT&T
By the way, I've never enjoyed an onside kick as much as the one yesterday. Hilarious.
Comment status: comments have been closed. Baseball Toaster is now out of business.