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NBA Finals Chat, Game 6 at 6 pm PT
2008-06-17 15:00
by Bob Timmermann

Welcome back to the Hub!

The Lakers managed to plug the Hybrid back in time for her to yell "jump!" and then the team was off to score a victory that was not sanctioned by either Mark Jackson or Jeff Van Gundy.

So the series presently stands at Celtics 3, Lakers 1 with one game still to be approved by a panel of stylistic experts. This matter is actually covered in the 12th Amendment to the Constitution as well as the NBA bylaws. The deciding vote in these matters is held by Oscar Robertson. So far, he has not been called on to use his vote, but he's on speed dial.

Today's question to ponder or even try to answer:

The last time the Celtics beat the Lakers to win the championship was in 1984. The decisive game was played on June 12. How many total pages did the L.A. Times run the next day in its entire Morning Final edition? For a point of reference, today's L.A. Times had 64 pages.


And now to be no fun. On Sunday, Jackie MacMullan of wrote a story about Doc Rivers and his relationship with his late father and why it would be meaningful for the Celtics to win on Father's Day. It's an interesting story, but hasn't this story been told before.

Now I can appreciate a story about a deceased parent like the next guy. Losing a parent is a deeply emotional experience. But the thing is: almost everybody will go through it during their lifetime. It doesn't ennoble you. It just makes you sad. Does Rivers, who likely isn't seeking any more sympathy than anyone else in his situation, have some special grief that is different than the millions of others in the world in the same situation? Are his accomplishments any greater or lesser because of his father's death?

Presumably Rivers' father is and should be immensely proud of his son's achievements in life no matter where you think the late Mr. Rivers is. Doc Rivers' father sounded like he was a tremendous man.

However. we're all more or less interchangeable in this world when you get down to it. We all have parents. Sometimes great parents. Sometimes lousy parents. We all want to do our best.

Comments (98)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-06-17 15:22:14
1.   Xeifrank
I will be watching bits and pieces of the game and will be turning it off, if at any point I feel an impending Boston championship celebration. It's time for the MVP to dominate like the MVP.
vr, Xei
2008-06-17 15:56:16
2.   Ken Arneson
"We all have parents."

Even the hybrids? Doggone it, Bob, don't give me spoilers like that!

2008-06-17 16:09:04
3.   The Mootz
The ABC announcing crew makes me miss the pure objectivity of Tommy Heinsohn.
2008-06-17 18:13:04
4.   Zak
I just want to know one thing. Is Bavetta refereeing this game or are the Lakers in trouble?

By the way, can you imagine the ratings for a Game 7?

2008-06-17 18:33:34
5.   Bluebleeder87
Did I hear that right? the celtic player left because they pocked his eyes & something about his nose??? sounds more like a bad episode of "The Three stooges"
2008-06-17 18:38:07
6.   SoSG Orel
5 I don't know, that sounds like a great "Three Stooges" episode to me.
2008-06-17 18:48:25
7.   Bob Timmermann
Despite the disparity in fouls, the Lakers aren't taking advantage.
2008-06-17 18:53:10
8.   Bluebleeder87
they can't score either, but I think it's more that the Celtics are playing good defense right?
2008-06-17 19:02:19
9.   fanerman
Ray Allen got injured and made a miraculous entry back into the game?
2008-06-17 19:03:37
10.   Bob Timmermann
Slip sliding away, slip sliding away
You know the nearer your destination, the more you slip sliding away
2008-06-17 19:03:53
11.   fanerman
Argh. James Posey. Ugh.
2008-06-17 19:05:33
12.   Bob Timmermann
I might put all Xavier alums on my obelisk.
2008-06-17 19:08:01
13.   fanerman
12 All Celtics are on my obelisk.
2008-06-17 19:08:24
14.   fanerman
Especially James Posey. But especially Paul Pierce.
2008-06-17 19:10:19
15.   Bob Timmermann
Don't the Lakers need to make more than 8 field goals?
2008-06-17 19:10:53
16.   weatherman
i hate the Celtics so much. This game is killing me. I am really get tired of Boston Sports teams.
2008-06-17 19:13:33
17.   Bob Timmermann
I guess it's time to put in a call to Eli Manning.

Or at least Aaron Boone.

2008-06-17 19:14:31
18.   PadreJeremy
To get through a tough West and then to piss it away including a choke in game 4 is so frustrating. The Lakers should beat the Celtics. Cant wait until next year though
2008-06-17 19:14:37
19.   Bluebleeder87

yeah I agree weather man, Boston Athletics be damned!

2008-06-17 19:14:38
20.   weatherman
That totally went out.
2008-06-17 19:15:40
21.   weatherman
Is Farmar the greatest Jewish Basketball player ever?
2008-06-17 19:16:51
22.   Bob Timmermann
I've asked that before, but I think Dolph Schayes holds that title.

Many of basketball's first stars were Jewish and sportswriters of the time (1920s and 1930s) thought that Jewish players had an affinity for the game.

2008-06-17 19:17:30
23.   fanerman
I don't think I've seen the Lakers make a field goal yet...
2008-06-17 19:19:16
24.   Bob Timmermann
Vujacic made the Lakers only field goal of the second quarter with 10:51 to play.
2008-06-17 19:19:53
25.   JoeyP

Lakers just didnt show up tonight.

I thought Kobe would end up being better than Jordan around 2000, but he's not even close.

2008-06-17 19:19:57
26.   weatherman
2008-06-17 19:21:28
27.   Bob Timmermann
I'm guessing that one made field goal in a quarter has to be close to an NBA record for the playoffs.
2008-06-17 19:22:41
28.   weatherman
Certainly a record for a Finals game 6.
2008-06-17 19:23:50
29.   bhsportsguy
25 Sure they showed up but they are getting beat by a team that frankly they don't really match up well against.

I have never understood why Kobe Bryant has to be compared to Michael Jordan, sure he made allusions to it when he first started as a rookie but to continually hold this up against him is just not fair.

2008-06-17 19:24:50
30.   fanerman
24 I didn't see it. This sucks.
2008-06-17 19:29:02
31.   Vishal
what a crappy game. i hate boston.
2008-06-17 19:29:29
32.   Vishal
that's not to say they aren't playing well and deserve to be winning at this point. i still hate them though.
2008-06-17 19:30:06
33.   bhsportsguy
Had the Lakers won this series, they would have probably set a record for Opponent's Winning Pct. as the four combined were 134 games over .500
2008-06-17 19:30:20
34.   underdog
13 What Fanerman said.

So, what else is on TV? :-/

2008-06-17 19:30:45
35.   Vishal
32 i guess there should be a "don't" in there before "deserve".
2008-06-17 19:30:55
36.   bhsportsguy
Well, perhaps this will be the springboard for another run.
2008-06-17 19:31:07
37.   underdog
This is a delayed reaction, but Farmar is Eric Davis' godson?! That was a random factoid.
2008-06-17 19:31:21
38.   Bob Timmermann
The NBA's website is really awful. I can't find out the fewest field goals in a quarter, but I can tell you that Travis Knight holds the record for fewest minutes played in a game in the playoffs and fouling out.

6 minutes!

I had forgotten Travis Knight was on the Lakers.

2008-06-17 19:32:14
39.   underdog
The Lakers looked like the Washington Generals to the Celtics' Globetrotters in that 2nd period.

Dear Andrew Bynum,

Are you suuuuuure you can't play tonight?

Lakers Fan

2008-06-17 19:33:43
40.   Travis08
33 The 1994-95 Rockets beat the 60-22 Jazz, the 59-23 Suns, the 60-22 Spurs, and the 57-35 Magic in the playoffs. Total: 148 games over .500.
2008-06-17 19:34:20
41.   Travis08
40 The Magic went 57-25 in 1994-95, not 57-35.
2008-06-17 19:35:38
42.   bhsportsguy
40 Great news.
2008-06-17 19:38:32
43.   JoeyP
This isnt as disappointing as 2004 at least. Phil's having a tough time getting #10.
2008-06-17 19:41:53
44.   Bob Timmermann
You're not Travis Knight are you?
2008-06-17 19:42:18
45.   underdog
The best news, whether you're a Lakers fan or Celtics fan, or just an NBA fan, is soon we won't have to listen to Michael Wilbon and Jon Barry blather on about the NBA (they'll blather on TV, but not during a broadcast we're all watching), and sometime a bit later, for those of who are Lakers fans, we'll at least have a few months without having to read Bill Simmons bashing everything that is Lakers or Los Angeles-related.

I see the light, I'm looking into the light...!

2008-06-17 19:43:07
46.   dianagramr
Kurt Rambis looks so ..... civilized.
2008-06-17 19:43:14
47.   Vishal
45 i don't have to listen to them already. i've stopped watching.
2008-06-17 19:43:35
48.   Travis08
38 The regular season record is 3 minutes, set by Bubba Wells of the Mavericks in a Hack-a-Rodman game. Knight just couldn't defend Tim Duncan without fouling.
2008-06-17 19:43:36
49.   JoeyP
Kobe's gonna have a long summer with the Olympics in August.

Celtics dont have any olympians do they?

2008-06-17 19:44:54
50.   bhsportsguy
49 Nope, Garnett isn't playing and Pierce was never considered.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-06-17 19:44:59
51.   underdog
I think Bob's met his doppelganger here!

47 I'm a masochist, but I did mute the sound awhile back at least. Maybe there's something good on Fox Soccer Channel.

2008-06-17 19:50:33
52.   Bob Hendley
This one is going to stick in my craw.
2008-06-17 19:54:50
53.   underdog
The Lakers atrocious defense seems to be like a virus. I blame Radmonovic as the contagious one. Now everyone has this no-defense-itis. They're just being dismantled. Sad.
2008-06-17 19:55:22
54.   JoeyP
Lakers have Kobe and Gasol in olympics.
Maybe Sasha?

That kind of sucks.
Lakers need rest for the summer.

2008-06-17 19:58:35
55.   grandcosmo
The Lakers need someone's father to die real quick so that they can rally for the victory.
2008-06-17 20:00:10
56.   underdog
Gernett just earned himself a special place on my obelisk.
2008-06-17 20:02:11
57.   bhsportsguy
I always felt this team was a year away but they played so well especially winning in Utah and then beating San Antonio in 5 it gave me hope that they could pull off another championship.

But I think losing this way in Boston will help.

Kevin Garnett had never beaten the Lakers before in a playoff series.

2008-06-17 20:07:18
58.   fanerman
57 I think we'll be better off next year. They'll be tougher. I hope. Especially with Bynum back.
2008-06-17 20:07:34
59.   fanerman
Anyway, time for a 4th quarter comeback, right?
2008-06-17 20:14:34
60.   trainwreck
I am having to hear so much crap from my bandwagon Warrior-fan friends.
2008-06-17 20:17:21
61.   underdog
60 Oh god, that shouldn't be hard to respond to, though, right?

The Lakers are IN the NBA finals. The Lakers won several championships not that long ago. Etc. The Warriors have been also-rans for so long Warriors fans have to grasp on to whatever they can, I guess blind hatred for LA makes them live on for another day.

2008-06-17 20:17:28
62.   trainwreck
I know Phil Jackson is a basketball guru and all and a great coach, but what in the world is he seeing with Radmanovic?

Radmanovic has the worst basketball IQ I have ever seen.

2008-06-17 20:18:05
63.   trainwreck
I have to bite my tongue or else they will get all butt hurt I told them the truth.
2008-06-17 20:18:12
64.   fanerman
60 I would not be able to take the crap from my Bostonian cousin (he lived there when he was 2 for the love of Ch-i!), so I blocked from internet chatting. I'll probably unblock him in a month.
2008-06-17 20:25:19
65.   trainwreck
I am happy for KG, Powe, Rondo, and Doc Rivers.

I hate the rest.

2008-06-17 20:25:34
66.   underdog
There's something about the Celtics shooting threes up by 30 points in the 4th quarter that strikes me as cruel. But they're making an impressive number of them, I guess it's hard to stop.
2008-06-17 20:28:20
67.   underdog
65 What about "one of the classiest guys in basketball" (says ABC) Sam Cassell?

Also, the city of Boston needed another sports championship.

No, but seriously, congrats to the Celtics, they deserved this one, clearly.

Next year the Lakers should play with a chip on their shoulder, and Bynum at center.

And I agree, I hope Vlad-Rad is gone next season. He is just awful. I don't understand how he's on the team, yet alone starting! That won't be the case next year no matter what, at least.

2008-06-17 20:29:08
68.   El Lay Dave
One disadvantage current Jordan air-apparents face that #23-45 did not is that you can no longer run that clear out the side play and other isolation maneuvers thanks to the legalization of the zone defense.

Next year the Lakers add a (hopefully full-recovered) Andrew Bynum. The Celtics add the last pick in the first round. Thank god Red Auerbach is dead and I don't have to see his cigar-smoking visage gloating once again.

2008-06-17 20:30:21
69.   JoeyP
62--The same thing he saw in Brian Cook.

Dumping Kwame, Cook, and Smush was the biggest positive of the season.

Ray Allen just keeps running that same play.

The Suns have to be kicking themselves for being so cheap. They could have had Rondo.

I dont think a game like this does LA any good. Its embarrassing.

2008-06-17 20:32:02
70.   fanerman
The Suns have to be kicking themselves for being so cheap.

You could say that for a lot of their moves.

2008-06-17 20:33:24
71.   weatherman
Lakers never expected to make the finals until fairly late in the season. The fact that LA is here without its starting center is pretty remarkable. LA will be better next year.
2008-06-17 20:41:55
72.   Bob Timmermann
While Doc Rivers late father looks down at his son with pride, Phil Jackson's late father looks down at his son with dismay.

Late fathers are so fickle.

2008-06-17 20:45:21
73.   dzzrtRatt
72 George Carlin was very funny on a recent comedy special about the idiocy of this "looking down on you and smiling" concept of one's deceased relatives. I can never hear anyone say that without inappropriately laughing.

The Mt. Olympus scenes in "Jason and the Argonauts" also create a funny mental picture of that concept.

2008-06-17 20:52:11
74.   fanerman
Why did Boston score 40+ points in the 4th quarter? Seriously. Why?
2008-06-17 20:52:16
75.   dianagramr
R.I.P. Cyd Charisse
2008-06-17 20:55:47
76.   thinkblue88
Congrats to the Celtics. =/

I officially hate the Celtics now.

2008-06-17 20:56:53
77.   dzzrtRatt
74 Perhaps it's because I have a dog, but it makes perfect sense to me.
2008-06-17 20:57:08
78.   dianagramr
leave Kevin alone!
2008-06-17 20:58:30
79.   max power
So many emotions!

Still really hate Ray Allen. Still hate Posey. Hate Cassell again, after a brief hiatus. Kinda hate KG and Doc Rivers. Fond of Rondo.

Still hate Vlad Rad. Can't deal with Luke. No confidence in Lamar. Big questions about Gasol. Miss Bynum like crazy. Fisher's seems like a good dude, but not an NBA point guard in 2008.

So full of hate...

2008-06-17 21:02:50
80.   Raf
Seems that the FCC was working overtime.
2008-06-17 21:05:41
81.   underdog
I wrote a defense of LA on my blog if anyone's interested, waited til game was officially over to publish it. Don't know why but it didn't really make me feel any better. But there we are.

2008-06-17 21:06:10
82.   underdog
And by LA I mean the place, not the Lakers.
2008-06-17 21:06:37
83.   underdog
77 ??
2008-06-17 21:07:04
84.   Lexinthedena
Lakers in '09

Bynum 5
Gasol 4
Odom 3
Kobe 2
FishFarm 1

Dump VladRad

re-sign Sasha
Ariza should be a key
Ronny is fine
Walton should be of no importance

Terrible way to go down. Season was a success.

I hate Boston.

2008-06-17 21:13:41
85.   Eric Stephen
I would like to see a story on someone's dead father "looking up at them" from Hell. Little Jimmy Stalin, getting inspiration from below.

Boston was so much cooler when they didn't win anything.

2008-06-17 21:19:25
86.   dzzrtRatt
83 When I walk my dog, he saves up his urine to deposit it on several key places in our neighborhood. His favorite thing is to lift his leg in front of other dogs' homes, preferably if they're on a balcony and forced to watch him.

That's what the Celtics were doing to the Lakers in the fourth quarter. Even if the Lakers go on to win the next two championships, the stench of this thrashing can never be removed. Or so the Celtics want to think.

2008-06-17 21:21:16
87.   underdog
86 Ah, I see. I fired there was more to that analogy. I was going to make a litterbox analogy but that one works better. ;-)

yes, indeed. Does anyone else feel like the Celtics poured it on unnecessarily in that last quarter, or should the Lakers share the blame for playing porous defense and looking defeated early? I kind of think it's both.

2008-06-17 21:22:06
88.   Eric Stephen
I keep telling myself, this is 1984, and the Lakers will win 3 of the next 4. Although I'm not willing to concede 2010 to the Celtics just yet.
2008-06-17 21:23:25
89.   Eric Stephen
I was watching -- well, the first 3 quarters anyway -- at a bar. Is it true that the Lakers went the entire 2nd quarter, and something like 17 minutes, without a FG?
2008-06-17 21:32:08
90.   Bob Timmermann
I'm more disappointed that no one took a stab at the trivia question.
2008-06-17 21:38:55
91.   Eric Stephen
Bob, I'll guess. I was out before, so I apologize for the delay. I'll say 89 pages.
2008-06-17 21:45:12
92.   Bob Timmermann
Eric, how in the world does a newspaper have an odd number of pages?
2008-06-17 21:53:22
93.   bhsportsguy
92 110 pages
2008-06-17 21:55:40
94.   Eric Stephen
My head's not right. Forgive me. I change my guess to 90.
2008-06-17 21:57:35
95.   underdog
102 pages.
2008-06-17 22:04:07
96.   Bob Timmermann
There were 118 pages.
2008-06-17 22:25:28
97.   Brent is a Dodger Fan
It is nice to be reminded that the Lakers weren't even supposed to get this far, but they showed such brilliance in the early rounds against tough competition, while the Celtics took 7 games to dispatch their first two round opponents. They sure tempted me...

I am looking forward to next year now.

And I'm so glad I don't have to hear Mark Jackson anymore. I felt like throwing a shoe at the television every time he described a player as a "knock down jump shooter". He just said it so many time about so many players that it started to make my skin crawl.

2008-06-17 22:44:17
98.   fanerman
97 The easy solution is to listen to something else. Though I suppose sometimes that isn't possible.

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